Generator Group Weblog

Recruiting in Second Life Part II: “Ghostown or Goldmine?”

By Lisa Peyton a.k.a. Avarie Parker

This concludes the virtual conversation I had with Brian Regan a.k.a. Printer Brian Dowd. He was the first to bring recruiting into Second Life and is in the process of helping other recruiting firms do the same. I wanted to get some additional insight into these projects and the future of this ever expanding Virtual World (VW). You can read the first part of our interview, “Recruiting in Second Life: “SL is not an easy button”, here: http://blog.generatorgroup.net/generator_weblog/recruiting_in_second_life/index.html

Avarie Parker: Hi Brian!

PrinterBrian Dowd: Good morning.

AP: I was checking out the job boards. Did you have anything to do with their creation?

PBD: Yes, Semper has a job boards division. We have job boards for Printing, Graphics and the Game Industry.

(Computer monitors on Human Resource Island proudly display Semper's job boards, printworkers.com http://www.printworkers.com/ and jobs.gigsingaming.com http://jobs.gigsingaming.com/).

AP: So could you please discuss the Tower Consultants (http://www.towerconsultants.com/) project a bit? Perhaps give an overview of the process or steps involved with such a project--the roles and individuals involved?

(Tower Consultants location in Second Life, http://slurl.com/secondlife/HumanResource%20Island/116/81/27) is located on Human Resource Island.)

PBD:  From a “Why they are here stand point”? Or from a “How did Semper build them their Second Life location”?; Would you like a cup of coffee?

Coffee Service (Click for a cup): Gives a cup of hot coffee to Printer Brian Dowd

AP: Sure!

PBD: Click on the pot.

AP: Got it, thanks!

Coffee Service (Click for a cup): Gives a cup of hot coffee to Avarie Parker.

AP: Oh goodness, too much multi-tasking...

PBD: LOL, part of modern business I am afraid.

AP: Yes. So I am curious about the process of building out the Tower SL local.

PBD: An easy way to explain it is that it’s like building a website, but more identifying how the firm wants to be branded, what they want in their location, what is their purpose for being there, and what programming and integration is needed.

AP: Ok, great. So you would work with a programmer, designer, project manager, etc?

PBD: Yes, but I do the PM side--like to make sure things are done right and things get moved along at the pace I expect.

AP: I see. So are you seeing SL skills like building, etc. translate into RL (real life) jobs??

PBD: Yes and No. Yes--if companies need SL things done and one is hired to do the project. No--if you want the skills they have to translate into a relevant skill in RL. Most people gain skills to do SL jobs. So things like Maya and Photoshop need to be learned and understood to do certain things in SL. The SL scripting language is a basic programming language. So the people have to learn it to be scripters, but it is not robust enough to make them a programmer in RL.  Although a lot of RL programmers are scripters here. So they entered SL with the skills already. Make sense?

AP: Yes, definitely. So at this point you aren't seeing full-time RL jobs that are devoted to scripting in SL? Is it primarily contract work?

PBD: There are some. But you are talking to someone that runs a contract based staffing firm so I like to provide development firms with contractors. I have a bias.

AP:  Do you think that there will be a need for people with these SL skills? Will the trend continue?

PBD: Hmmm, I think there will. It will be a specialty, not a huge market. I suspect at some point soon VWs will be easy to make--like buying canned website software.

AP: So I if I can back up for a minute. Perhaps you could discuss Tower's goals within SL and have they been successful?

PBD: Not 100% my place to say. I can say that they have gained exposure and I have fielded questions from people at Harvard and a few large firms about the question you just asked. The current phase of their SL project is explorative at this point. It reaches into areas that I cannot speak of. The whole “understanding the people in SL and how to interact” question. You know--the stuff I get paid to consult on. :)

AP: So they are looking at this as a longer-term project, perhaps even planning out a few years then?

PBD Yes. I will say this; if your firm is interested in SL, consider having me do the project. I understand staffing, and SL makes for the right mix.

AP: So, predictions...we have touched on it a bit but if I were to ask you: Recruiting in SL - Goldmine or Ghost town? What side of the fence would you come down on??

PBD: Heh, neither. But I edge more on the goldmine, although it’s more like a small tip of a large gold vein; sticking out of the ground. Potential, but lots of work needed to dig it out. This is really just starting; VWs will have a big impact on recruitment and not just from the agency side. The large firms in here today already are using it. I have seen new jobs created that focus on VWs as a recruitment platform and not just recruiter level --Director level.

AP: I would love to do that!!!

PBD: So your large clients will be in VWs in some fashion or another.

PBD: It would be nice to work from home and use a VW as your office.

AP: So tell me about your Avatar. Is it custom??

PBD: Yes, of course. Residents don’t interact as much with the default avatars walking around. I guess its like--if you care enough to take the time to make up your avatar, you are less likely to have ulterior motives I guess. You could think of it like all those Myspace friends requests you get from the no detail profile with one picture and no friends. LOL.

AP: So what does “custom” mean exactly? Is it based on how you really look??

PBD: No, just not a basic look. You took time on yours - the clothing is not default stuff and your hair is not default. You have glasses on.

AP: Is it possible to hire someone to create a custom skin?

PBD: People do it but usually only celebs have them done. Going rate is about $150 - $300 US. Buying a skin is the most common.

AP: So do you feel all the shopping and consumerism in SL leads to more buying in the RL? Like the way some people believe violent video games lead to real violence?

PBD: I do not believe that. Bad parenting creates what you said :) I don’t know about the shopping side but I suspect it does.

AP: So you feel there is a link between someone buying tons of stuff in SL and then deciding to buy something in RL?

PBD: I am not a marketing type person but I think it does. Branding is branding, and it’s about trust.

(Aveda offers real life hairstyles in SL, residents can purchase the hair using SL Currency called Linden Dollars.)

(Another example of in-world branding, there is an unofficial Nike store in Second Life, offering virtual T-shirts and work-out gear.)

AP: If a person gets a high from buying pretty stuff in SL, who's to say they won't take that into the RL and try to get that same feeling in their real lives. Do you feel that SL encourages classicism?? Someone might be able to buy a diamond necklace in-world, but could never afford that in RL.  Is that a good thing?

PBD: Don’t really know. I am not a big shopper.

AP: From a psychological perspective, do you think there are deeper issues here?

PBD: Well, your question is rather large.

AP: Yes, I was struck by a woman I met in SL that wanted to buy some land but had to wait until her RL paycheck cleared the bank.  She had a HUGE presence in SL, tavern owner, etc., but couldn't afford the small RL sum to pay for a small parcel of land. It made me think about the idea of escapism, and are VWs going to be a way for people to escape their lives?

PBD: Yes, but does a VW cause that? No. If you remove VWs, does it go away? No. What I like about Interactive Media over traditional is simple: a person’s mind is engaged and they are part of the story or event. T.V. for example tells us the story and we simply watch and have no control over what’s happening. Interactive media, such as video games and VWs, is much more engaging for the mind. Second Life is very interesting in the sense that you create your own experience in many ways. You can build what you want, buy what you want, hang out with whom you want. Does it all equal escapism? I imagine it does, but most things in moderation seem fine to me. It’s when it’s done to an excess that causes worry.

AP: I agree absolutely. So a final question: every time I talk about SL, I still hear someone say, "Oh, that’s weird" or some similar judgment about the people that are in-world.  How would you respond to those people?

PBD: LOL, We are all educators. Ever read Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand?

AP: Of course, I have read everything by her.

PBD: There are people that do, those that don’t, and those that want, but cannot achieve. It is easy to look at something new and pass judgment while having no true understanding of what it is. Or allowing other peoples opinion to be your own, without taking a small amount of time to reflect upon it yourself. So the true question is: who in their right mind would pass judgment on something new while not understanding it? 1993 and the Internet explosion is still recent news.

AP: Brilliant quote to end on. Thank you so much for your time. I wish you the best with all of your virtual ventures.

Recruiting in Second Life : “SL is not an easy button”

By Lisa Peyton, a.k.a. Avarie Parker

I—well, my avatar Avarie Parker--was recently lucky enough to sit down for a virtual interview with Printer Brian Dowd, real life President of Semper International LLC. Brian Regan, and his Boston based firm Semper International, was the first recruiting agency to enter Second Life in March 2007. He has expanded his in-world presence from candidate sourcing to offering services for other companies looking to go virtual. The interview spanned two meetings; this is our first conversation in its entirety.

Avarie Parker: Why did Semper International decide to enter the world of SL? What were your initial goals?

PrinterBrian Dowd: I’m a big time Online Video Game player. Also interested in Serious Games, or the use of video game technology for business application. Our goal was to use SL as a business tool in connecting with people from a distance, as well as understanding how to interact with people in online worlds. So learning and business application was stage one, more or less. We knew that there was not a large population; however, the population here did match some of our specialties like graphic design and video game staffing. Most people in SL early on had tech or design type backgrounds. We also wanted to find a venue to reach out to an audience accustomed to using the internet as a work condition--things like “Can you have a contractor/employer relationship via an online world?”

AP: Can you give me a rough estimate of the cost involved in your campaign?

PBD: That’s not quite as straightforward as you might think

AP: Perhaps you could give a range...

PBD: You can set up a small location with limited functionality for $500 - $1000. If you wanted to immerse yourself in SL and learn to build and script, you could do a small location for less, and increase the time you spend working on it yourself. For me, I was an online gamer in my personal life, so I took the latter approach. An entire Island like you are on now is a much different situation. There you are talking $10,000 + and a lot of your own personal time--or let developers do it all and spend $20,000.

AP: Thanks, that answers my question - how many people were involved in a project like the island?

PBD: Very few.

AP: Really? Have you taught yourself how to script, etc?

PBD: Basic scripting and building, yes.

AP: Very Cool! I took a stab at designing a garment and found it to be very labor intensive!

PBD: Like online games, it’s a passion thing.

AP: Yes. Has the SL campaign directly contributed to selling Semper services? Which services have been most affected? Employer side? Employee? Or outplacement? Have you traced the campaign directly to an increase in profits?

PBD: We have generated income from SL at this point, yes. We have successfully recruited and placed people we located in SL. Does it compare to investing in a Monster or CB package? No. However it gives a bit more than just people, it gives business side benefits: company meetings, mass recruitment, using it as a tool. So it is more than one element.

(Above: PrinterBrian and his coworker Gia speaking at a recent Interview workshop on Human Resource Island)

AP: About how many RL placements have you had?

PBD: Less than 10, although our database has picked up over 100.

AP: But how long have you been in SL? Less than a year, right?

PBD: Yes, March 1st we launched.

AP: So for such a short time in that seems like a big number!

PBD: Ah, OK.  Now you must consider that I work it here--meaning I am logged in and developing relationships quite often. This location generates traffic, I generate results. Does that make sense?

AP: Hmm, yes. What questions should a recruiting firm ask itself before embarking on an SL campaign?

PBD: Easy. Does anyone on staff have the energy and willingness to make it work? Spend off-hours doing interviews and getting to know people in SL. Would you rather hang out in SL or on your Myspace account? If the answer is no, then you may end up spinning your wheels and have no traffic.

AP: SL! I would MUCH prefer to spend time in here than on Myspace...: )

PBD: LOL. OK, so when I arrived you were chatting with Lewis. You met him here on the Semper Island?

AP: Yes, while I was waiting for you. He's a Graphic Artist out of Binghamton, NY. I told him he should perhaps register with you guys as a candidate.

PBD: OK, so there you go - A graphic artist in NY, placeable if good. If you have a location where he is.

AP: Yes. So should the industry the recruiting firm works in be considered? I mean SL is an obvious choice if you are looking for GAs or programmers, etc, but how about other industries? Tower, for example, deals with HR placements...not exactly hi-tech.

PBD: Yes, you should consider it if you expect to extract people from SL. However, if you want to use it in replacement of video conferencing and phone, it brings a different value. You and I both have Voice Enabled, but we are not using it. It is free to use voice here, no charge. 50 people in a room all able to talk at no charge is an interesting thing to think about, to expand upon.

AP: A very useful and cost effective tool for meetings, etc.

PBD: Yes, or mass interviews.

(Above: Attendees at a recently attended SL Conference)

AP: Describe how you began your SL consulting services and do you think they will eclipse your recruiting services?

PBD: No it will not. It’s not our focus; however it allows us to test talent. We are also staffing companies in the game industry as well as Second Life or Virtual Worlds development companies, so interviewing someone for an SL dev firm and then seeing their work is effective for us--and not just from a talent standpoint, but a professional standpoint too. Do they meet deadlines, act a certain way, work in teams or solo, etc.?

AP: Do you have any full-time staff devoted to your SL Consulting?

PBD: No full time staff, but more than one trained person that handles SL consulting.

AP: Do you feel the trend for companies to want in to SL will continue? What do you feel the future of marketing in SL looks like?

PBD: I am not a big fan of the marketing in SL fad. However, if this is a possible direction of the internet in the near future, then any firm that uses the internet as a tool should have an understanding of it.

AP: Can you point to any in-world campaigns that you feel were successful? National campaigns, I mean.

PBD: I am not really focused on that side, so I would likely not be a good judge. Consider this - VW's allow you to develop your brand in a community or experience that is interactive and that is not understood yet. VW = Virtual Worlds. So if you want to create an online experience around your firm or brand, building a VW whether SL or any number of VW's out there will have a large impact on how people interact with you.

AP:Yes, but you obviously engage in marketing Semper in-world...and Semper's services.  But it sounds like you are more interested in an interactive experience than seeing Coke machines all over the place?

PBD: Coke machines all over the place is not the total answer. It helps, but it’s like banner ads on a website.

AP: Would you say there are companies that are "getting it" when it comes to interacting with SL residents?

PBD: Yes, those that build communities.

AP: Speaking of communities, how can a candidate best leverage SL? Any specific groups or locals they should visit?

PBD: Hmmm, that’s a big question.  I would say, there are groups and experiences here for all tastes. A personal taste in their personal time is not likely related to their professional ones. As a recruiter I am sure you can appreciate what I just said.

AP: Yes. : ) There are networking groups that charge to join--do you feel those groups are worth it? Can you give me a short list of the top business networking groups in SL?

PBD: Not really, I don’t pay to be in any of those groups. I would think they may be a good way to start out, but you quickly move past them.

AP: So how does the experienced SLer go about finding a great RL job?

PBD: Come to the Semper location :) (http://slurl.com/secondlife/HumanResource%20Island/207/101/27); IBM (http://slurl.com/secondlife/IBM/106/5/23) does cool things. TMP (http://slurl.com/secondlife/TMP%20Worldwide/190/43/22) does career fairs.

(Above: Semper International SL Location)

AP: Great, finally something my candidates can sink their teeth into!

PBD: I would say that there is a whole lot of recruiting happening in SL.  It’s just not that obvious.

AP: So how can a recruiter best leverage SL??

PBD: Networking, passive recruiting, developing a community, talking to people, gaining friends, leveraging friends, knowing who’s who and becoming a valuable asset to them.

AP: But again, I would assume it's time consuming - yes?

PBD:Yes, anything worthwhile in life requires effort. SL is not an easy button.

AP: There's the headline for my article - I love it!

PBD: LOL. Staples is a great client of ours. They will be excited I used it.

AP: Thank you again for taking the time to talk with me today.  I really appreciate it.

PBD: No problem. I will not likely give away the valuable lessons I’ve learned but I would like to make sure the integrity of recruitment and VW's is upheld and thus I’m willing to help out people on many levels.

AP: Wonderful! Perhaps a few more probing questions tomorrow can loosen you up a bit.

PBD: LOL.

Stay tuned for our second conversation where we dive below the surface of SL discussing consumer-user behavior, relationships within SL, and Avatar creation. If you would like to learn more about the services his company offers, you can contact him via SL on Human Resources Island (http://slurl.com/secondlife/HumanResource%20Island/188/111/27 ) or email him at bregan@semperllc.com.